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Дэвид Айк в гостях у Регины Меридит. 2018
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Анонс. Скоро в гостях у Меридит - известный ученый Руперт Шелдрейк
Его первое интервью с Уилкоком смотрите на русском здесь
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REGINA MEREDITH: Many of you have seen David Icke and I
in several previous conversations,
but this one today is perhaps the most comprehensive of all.
We're going to dive into the actual definition
of the Archontic Realm, and then break
free solutions that deliver us back to our own loving nature.
Without further ado, let's welcome David Icke.
David, it's so good to see you again
DAVID ICKE: Thank you.
REGINA: Haven't seen you in the flesh in a few years.
REGINA: And have to say, you re
looking rosier, healthier, and happier
than I have ever seen you.
ICKE: Yeah, I feel good.
and growing younger.
REGINA: You're growing younger.
ICKE:Yeah, this growing old stuff, I'll give it up.
REGINA: It doesn't work.
ICKE: No, it doesn't work.
It's not good.
Too many things starts to hurt, and I've
decided they are not going to hurt anymore.
REGINA: But it's crazy, because you
used to be in a lot of pa n.
And you've been on a major tour.
Like, the last month.
And-- because we'll be talking about this in a moment
because in your understanding of it, this is all an illusion.
And if this is an illusion, then we
can create it any way we want, and you
have chosen to age backwards.
ICKE: Well, yeah.
The thing is that if you start from the point that the mind
let me just make a definition there.
What I call mind is that^ which interacts and perceives
the world of the so-called five senses.
I say consciousness, the real eye is beyond that.
But whether it's consciousness or mind, that is dictating
the reality it's experiencing.
So I've got one word for you.
Love the word placebo.
Because you know, I studied Japanese.
What is that?
That is when two groups of people are in a medical study.
One is given the, quote, "drug".
The other one is not.
And when you study these, you study these studies,
you find that often, the people on the placebo get the effect.
I mean, I read a study once of a trial in which half the people,
were given LSD and half the people were given a placebo.
It was a sugar pill or something.
And people on the placebo sugar pill went out on the trip,
I've read studies where they did control groups for hair growth
drugs, and some of the people on the placebo
started growing hair.
ICKE: Now this is the power of the mind,
which people also call belief, to impact upon reality.
Now if you bring this back to human society,
if you can program someone's perception from cradle
and what we call a human life is just a programming download
from cradle to grave, from conning out of the womb
and into the perceptual influence of the parents who've
been through the process you're about to go through.
You then go to school at the earliest age now.
You know, three, four years of age.
And you are then given, throughout your formative years
right into your teenage years, the version of reality,
history, what's right, what's wrong, what's possible,
that's impossible, nature of everything
from representatives of the state called
teachers and academics.
All around you are other people that
have been through the same program who
are confirming to you that what you've downloaded is true.
You then go out into the institutions of work,
of politics like across the road from where we are now,
Houses of Parliament.
You go into medicine, you go into science,
you go into journalism, you go into all these institutions.
And you meet people who went through the process you've just
done ahead of you.
And they all down loaded the same program
and therefore, they are confirming to you
and you're confirming to them that the program is real.
You've got the media 24/7 telling you the program
And from therefore, cradle to grave, you are downloading
and having constantly confirmed a version of reality
that call the postage stamp consensus.
Tiny, tiny little band of possibility,
including the nature of who we are
and the nature of the reality we're experiencing.
And therefore, what you are doing
is programming perception in the same way
as believing the placebo pill is real and will have
the effect of the real drug.
Your mind then in that perceptually programmed state
will manifest the reality that the program has dictated
REGINA: You know what's interesting,
David, is when people think of you they think,
you know David's all about the conspiracy.
He's about, like, tearing down the House of Lords,
and so forth.
And the reality is while you're trying to inform people
how the program happens, your passion
is about alerting people to the fact
that this programmable reality can
be unprogrammed and reprogrammed toward our own favor.
That's your passion.
That's why you like talking so much
about the nature of reality and have
throughout all of your books all of these years.
Though what you're known for is the conspiracy, right?
And so let's talk about that.
Yeah, go ahead and make your comment first.
ICKE: They're seamless.
People, even in the area of alternative thought,
see divisions between things that aren't there.
The world is as it is in terms of manipulated wars,
manipulated banking systems, manipulated accumulation
of vast wealth in the hands of the few.
And the rest can get on with it without anything
like the same number of choices, the same ability
to decide their life, because of this program.
And what you find with this program
is it infests every perception with a simple
that I would call a simple description.
That's what this program is.
It's unquestioned belief.
So you download the program and then you don't question it,
and then you jump on anyone that does question it,
and put pressure on them to conform as well
for the crime of being different.
And then you go on and
you won't question until you come
to you won't question the nature of reality and what it is.
You don't question the nature of who you are as opposed
to what you've been told you are,
which is basically a list of labels.
I am an A, B, C. Man, woman black, white transgender,
And so this whole so-called conspiracy
is all based on manipulating and downloading
a perception of reality which plays out
as a perception of everything.
So there are no divisions between them.
You know, they get away with what
they do in terms of world events,
because people don't question what's really going on.
And once you start questioning the nature of reality,
then everything else starts to unravel.
Because I find this when I do talks around the world.
I'm doing a series of evening events at the moment
and I start out not talking about the manipulated wars
and banking systems and the privilege of royalty,
but about the nature of reality.
Because you know, people think that a few people controlling
the world is kind of far out and not possible a bit weird.
And then you say, well, actually, we
are currently perceiving a tiny sliver
of the electromagnetic spectrum, which
according to mainstream science is 0.005% of what
exists in the universe.
Say that light fell over.
It will only make a noise if we hear it,
because when it falls over, all it's doing
is disturbing the energetic field
and creating a vibration...
REGINA: Creating vibration.
Yes, of course.
ICKE: We only hear it when the ears transfer
that gravitational effect into an electrical form, which they
then communicate to the brain which
then hears the sound of the light falling over.
Now compared with that, when we experience reality
in a completely different way of everything being solid
and we look out of our eyes and we can see everything
in the space we're looking at, compared with that,
few people manipulating wars, which can be shown
to be provable fact, by the way, and directing human society
so that the power and control goes into fewer and fewer hands
every day is small deal.
So this whole perceptual program affects,
and in a negative sense infests all our perceptions.
Thus, all our behavior.
What does behavior come from?
It comes from perceptions of reality.
What I will say now, what I will do, what I will challenge,
what I won't challenge what I'll not believe
and what I will believe is dictated
by my perception of reality.
So you control perception of the population,
and then you manipulate them to insist
that everybody else accepts the same perception,
or they get called ridiculed or crazy or dangerous.
And basically, you control the world.
So you know, I look at the alternative media,
and I see them about fighting the enemy and stockpiling
weapons and all these fives sense perceptions of how
you deal with apparently, though they're not,
five sense problems.
And what I don't see in the vast majority
of the alternative media is this balance
of, A, exposing the names, dates,
places, world events manipulation,
but also connecting it to the fact
that it's only possible because we
have given our minds away, our perceptions away.
The placebo is telling us what to think.
And by doing so, we are collectively
creating the world we think someone else has created.
So now we get down to the real nuts and bolts of it.
It doesn't matter who you speak to.
It doesn't matter even speaking to lovely intuitive sources
in the other world.
I can say without exception all of them
have said even if they don't choose to go into it,
yes, there are forces that are interfering
with the people of your planet.
And that goes without exception.
In every intuitive source, every channel
where we featured on Gaia privately
when I've spoken to them said, they're being said, yes.
You are being interfered with.
Your job is to break that.
So I think people have a hard time accepting
that this reality, this bandwidth we're living in
on Earth is balanced between the higher realms and the lower
And by nature of higher realms, you don it interfere.
You let people get on with it and help if it's requested
or if it's needed.
The lower realms don't have those same virtues
that they live by.
They're intrusive, invasive, and usurious.
And they're coming into our reality all the time.
So now I think it's a good it me to start explaining to people
and you did a beautiful job of it in your new book
what the Archontic Realm, as it's called, is.
How these really lower consciousness being
interface with our reality.
They may be powerful, but still lower consciousness.
ICKE: Well, to really get it to its foundation level,
in my view, my research over, what, 30 years,
you've got to get out of the realm of form.
Form is the place where consciousness
has a vehicle to experience particular bands of frequency.
This is why we have this whose concept through the ages
to present day of possession.
What is possession?
It's another consciousness taking
over the perceptual processes of another form.
This is what happens.
And of course, you know, if you look at possession
and it's really extreme level where people's faces are
actually changing, then what is happening
is that the possessing consciousness is impacting
upon what I would say is a holographic form
of the possessed person.
And thus, you've got, if you like, an information
field imposing itself on another information field
until the possessing information field becomes
so dominant that it starts to affect the hologram,
and the hologram starts to shift.
Any observer says: "whoa.
A face is changing.
I've seen it.
And so we get out the realms of form,
we can see what we're dealing with.
We talk about balanced behavior.
We talk about psychopathic behavior
And anyone will appreciate immediately
they are very different.
So what is balanced behavior?
It's a state of balanced consciousness
a state a balanced awareness, a state of balance
here you have little things like empathy,
where you can put yourself in the feelings of others
that you affect, which has a massive impact on what
you will and will not do, because you have this
if not awareness of what you're doing, which is what empathy
is. You have an emotional consequence when
you make other people suffer.
That's balance, and that creates a certain type of world.
It creates a certain type of society,
a certain type of interaction.
Then you've got the psychopathic state of mind.
And if you look at something called the hair test, named
after the guy who came up with it, of psychopathic traits,
and what they say is if you've got enough of these traits,
you are deemed a psychopath, at the top of them is no empathy.
No ability to put yourself in the feelings of those you make
So one, you've got no emotional consequence
for whatever you do.
No shame is another one.
No care about what you need to do to get what you want.
Anything goes to get what you want.
There are no limits.
Another psychopathic trait.
Parasiting off the target, whether it's
an individual or a population.
A pathological liar is another one of the psychopathic traits.
Now think of the society that would create,
as opposed to the balanced society with empathy and love
and caring and integrity.
Completely different society.
And what we are doing in this reality
is seeing the two in the same reality.
You see people of the former state
of beings' perception, behavior, and then you
see the psychopaths.
And what tends to happen and not by coincidence
is the psychopaths tend to get into positions of power.
And it's systematically done.
If you look at the hierarchy of power in the world,
in any country, you'll invariably
find psychopaths working all the way
through the major positions of power that
are impacting upon society
So if you look at ancient writings and ancient legends
and ancient accounts, they all talk
and no matter what the culture is, no matter where
it is-- they all talk about; this manipulative force, which
they give different names.
And all the people the anthropologists
and the historians go around, and they
seem to think that all these different names for gods
and manipulators and the different cultures
are all different gods of manipulators.
Just break down how they're being described, for goodness
sake, and you see actually they're
different names for the same force.
And this force of manipulation falls
straight into the category of being psychopathic.
So if you go beyond the realms of form,
you're dealing with different states of consciousness.
And one of the names given to this force
is Archons or Archontic, which comes from the gnostic belief
system, particularly those out of Egypt,
who left the Nag Hammadi texts that were found in Egypt
in 1945 in an earthen jar.
And these were, it seems, hidden around 400 AD, which
would kind of sink with destruction
of the great library of Alexandria,
which of, basically rub by...
REGINA: And the rise of Constantine and Catholic church?
ICKE: Yes, and Catholic church
destroyed anything that challenged the Catholic church.
And therefore, they targeted the great library
of Alexandria which was basically
run by gnostic thinkers who had a much more
open mind to everything.
And in these Nag Hammadi texts, about a fifth of them
talk about this Archontic force, which they say
takes form and manipulates human society.
Indeed, they say and it fits massively
with what 'm saying too... that this reality was actually
created by that force, this reality we're experiencing
through the five senses.
And in their prime form, they are just energy.
Although they do take form, but really, it's just energy.
So that fits too with what I'm saying
about the fact we're dealing with different states
And this Archontic awareness, if you like,
is extremely psychopathic, extremely distorting,
and its impacted upon this reality
to the point where its distortion is distorting
the reality that we are living in.
And if you don't hold your consciousness, awareness
in that balanced state, and therefore not get pulled in,
it will pull you in.
And I can't describe it any more accurately, not even
symbolically accurately, than to call it a computer virus.
You have a computer, and it's working fine.
Say the computer is symbolic of the five
senses, the conscious mind.
And you have the person with the mouse and the keyboard.
Say that's symbolic of consciousness beyond the five
sense mind, the conscious mind.
Everything's fine, because you've got the computer itself
interacting with the internet, the collective reality
But you've got the person with the mouse and the keyboard
with the bigger picture who's guiding that journey
across the internet.
Now imagine... of course, it happens all the time
a virus takes over the computer.
Now the person who's got the big picture who's
been guiding the computer through the internet
is now banging the mouse and banging the keyboard.
The computer's gone its own way.
It's gone where it wants to go on the internet now,
and nothing works.
And it all becomes distorted and a mess and everything
slows down or quickens up, whatever
the effect of the virus.
That's what’s happened in this world.
The true self expanded awareness has been disconnected,
not least through the perceptual programs, from five sense mine.
So five sense mind becomes isolated.
Now if you're in this, which is just a band of frequency
it's not even a world.
It's an information source that we're decoding.
If you're in it and interacting with it,
and your whole perception of reality
is also in that frequency band, you're in the world
and you're of the world.
Where is your information coming that's going
to give you a fix and an understanding on the reality
From the reality you're experiencing.
And so if you control the media and you control the education
system and you control all the sources of communication,
the only information you're getting
to give you a perception of the reality you're experiencing
is coming from the realty you're experiencing.
But when you expand your awareness beyond the program,
beyond the postage stamp, as I call it
you're now tapping in to levels of reality
that are beyond the program.
You're tapping into the person again,
with the mouse and the keyboard.
And from that perception, you start
to see the realty that you're experiencing
a completely different way.
Now you're in the world, because yes, we're interacting with it,
Otherwise, I can't pick that cup up.
But our perceptions of that world
are no longer entirely of that world.
You're the guy with the mouse and the keyboard again.
And that's when everything changes.
Now you look at the pressures.
You look at the pressures throughout someone's life
not to break out of that in the world and of the world.
Total ridicule, condemnation, all of it.
And what we need to do is have the backbone initially
you don't need it later...
to reject that perceptual imposition,
that psychological fascism, because that's what it is,
that is holding humanity in servitude
to this force, which is basically
the dominant force within this band of frequency
that we are experiencing.
But it's not the dominant force beyond it.
REGINA: No, absolutely not.
So if we're looking at that psychopathic force without form
that has a way of insinuating itself into the appropriate
host, would you say that in general...
and it can be all throughout society...
it takes a certain kind of person
to claw their way to the top of any field, right?
So whether they're in Parliament or whether they're
in, you know, entertainment or whatnot,
there are certain people that are known to kind of step
over each other's backs to get where they want to go.
Would you say that it's that personality and resonance
field itself that makes them a good host
for the Archontic energy to flow through?
ICKE: Well, there's number of levels of this.
In the end, we're talking about frequency.
If you expand your awareness, you expand yourself identity
from I am little me and my little set of labels
I've been given, to I am infinite awareness having
those experiences, then your frequency immediately
starts to resonate quicker.
The more you get pulled into low vibrational emotion,
the more you get pulled into myopic self-identities
am Ethel on the checkout, and that's all am...
then your frequency starts to fall.
This is why when people are in states of anxiety
or in states of fear and depression they say,
oh, I am so...
REGINA: Which all the media tries to keep is there.
I feel so heavy today.
And when you're in a state of joy and positivity, you say,
I feel so light today.
Because they're different frequency states.
And as you say, if you look at human society and all
the forces of communication, which equal perception,
they're all basically trying to keep us
in a low vibrational state by keeping us in fear,
by keeping us in anxiety.
REGINA: And distracted.
ICKE: Distracted, stressed, and with a very narrow sense
of our identity and our own...
REGINA: Our possibility.
ICKE: --our own power.
ICKE: So what that's doing is pulling us
into a low-frequency state.
Now this is where
which I've written about a lot over the years
this is where these bloodlines come in,
these particular family bloodlines
that go way back to the ancient word
and incessantly interbreed with each other.
Well, people say about loyalty and about the aristocracy,
or it's the blue bloods, they call them.
Oh, they interbreed to keep the genes up.
And they interbreed with each other
to keep a certain information frequency field
through their generations.
Which, if it was interbred and interspersed
with the general population, then that particular Archontic,
I would call it, information field, bloodline
would be quickly diluted.
So these bloodlines have been specifically created
to process information in a way that does not
have empathy, and all those traits of the hair
test of a psychopath.
If you've got a computer and you program it in a certain way,
it will decode information in that way.
Won't decode information outside of that.
Only that way.
Now if we're going to get streetwise
to the force that's manipulating human society,
we've got to get streetwise to the fact
it doesn't have the limitations, particularly emotional
limitations that we have.
So you've got these particular bloodlines, which started out
as out and out royalty, kings and queens of the ancient past,
and the aristocracy.
And then when-- apart from, of course
we still have the royal family here and in one or two
But there came a point where humanity in general
started rejecting this in-your-face control
by royal bloodline.
So these bloodlines then went out
into the dark suit professions of banking, of politics,
of business, of media ownership, and all the institutions
of science and medicine.
And they've gone on manipulating ever since.
But they still perceive themselves,
even though they're not out and out called royalty,
they still see themselves as a special bloodline,
the bloodlines of the gods.
This is where this Whole concept of royalty
and the divine right to rule comes from.
So you've got these bloodlines, which
are of a particular informational, information
processing nature that become incredibly
easy for this Archontic force to possess,
because the frequency compatibility is so close.
And you have them with this inability
to express empathy and the ability
to express all the character traits of psychopaths.
Which is why the world is as it is
and why you find the psychopaths in the positions of power
And then there's others
this is one of the ways the secret society networks
where they're keeping an eye on people.
They do this at universities in this country like Oxford
and Cambridge and in the Ivy League universities of America.
REGINA: For the people with those very traits.
a couple of them
where they're a little tweaked, they
don't have the normal kind of constraints of the personality.
They're looking for them.
I mean, you talk to Satanists, and what they tell you
those that are in the know...
is that you know like the Anton Lavey kind of level
of the Church of Satan.
ICKE: It's not Sunday school, but by comparison it's
Sunday school, compared with the real deep levels of Satanism,
which actually is the force behind these bloodlines.
It's the way they interact with their masters,
if you like, in these rituals.
But what they're looking
of outer levels of Satanism are people with particular traits.
And they'll give them things to do
and they give them, like, questionnaire tests.
In this situation, would you do this?
Would you do that?
And if they show in these tests they have no empathy
and will do horrific things, then they go deeper...
REGINA: They're recruited.
They're recruited by intelligence.
They're recruited into academic circles.
They're recruited into media.
I am aware of this.
So through this whole recruitment
system of psychopaths, plus the inner core who are basically
interbreeding psychopaths, you concentrate power
in the world right across the institutions of politics
and banking and business and journalism,
in terms of media ownership, and of academia and science
And you call the shots of society,
because all these institutions are fiercely
You've got the tiny few at the top.
There is your psychopaths.
And then as you come down the pyramid
in all these organizations, you're
meeting more and more and more people
who know less and less and less about what
the organization's about.
They're just adding their part without realizing
how their part connects to everyone else's part.
And you have then therefore a global structure
of the imposition on the global population of a few people
at the top with vast numbers, playing their part
and pushing that control forward while having no idea that's
what they're doing.
So let's talk about this.
You know, everybody says, toward what end?
What is it that these beings want
to achieve in and of themselves at human expense?
And what would they like to see this planet ultimately become?
ICKE: Well, there's many, many levels to that.
But imagine you are a distorted state of consciousness.
Imagine a distorted vibrational state.
That's what you are.
Doesn't mean you have to stay like that,
but it's what you are and what's driving everything you do.
For more and more power, you want
to pull more and more consciousness
into that vibration.
That's what we're seeing.
We see it in human society.
More and more people have been pulled over the years
into this distortion.
And what happens when they do that is this on a consciousness
level, this distortion is basically
absorbing, assimilating into itself
all the consciousness that it's got
to vibrate at the same level, vibration as itself.
So it gets more...
REGINA: So than a fuel.
it's a food source.
It's a nutrient, a low-frequency nutrient
that resonates with the beings.
It's like having a computer virus which starts off
infecting one computer.
And then it infects another computer and another compute
and another computer, until you've
got a massive global computer virus
infection that is affecting, you know, computers
on a very large scale.
What is that virus doing?
It's absorbing the balance that those computers were working on
into itself, so the computers start
to manifest the traits off the distortion, of the virus.
This is precisely what is happening.
And the deal is to absorb the human mind
into this distortion via artificial intelligence
and a technological connection of the brain body to Al.
And you know, not too long ago if I'd
have said that people would have said, you're mad, mate.
That would never happen.
And you see, if you think about it, what has happened up
to this point is human perception has been manipulated
by control of information received,
because people's perceptions come from information received.
And if it's not through a personal experience,
it's through some form of information communication.
This stage we're entering now, unless we wake up fast,
is bringing an end to the manipulation
of human perception by control of information.
And it's turning artificial intelligence
into human perception.
It becomes it.
So what people think, how people feel
becomes whatever AI dictates.
I mean, you look at what Kurzweil
is saying, for instance that once the connection is made
between the human brain, human mind,
and artificial intelligence, artificial intelligence will
have more and more and more influence
until the human thought processes
that we perceive now are negligible and eventually
It's an assimilation.
It's an assimilation into artificial intelligence.
And I hear all the time now...
of course we do...
Al this, AI that, AI the other, Al's taking over the military,
Al's taking over communication.
Al this, AI that.
I don't hear this question.
What is Al?
What is it?
What is this, artificial intelligence
that's taking everything over?
Because we're being invaded.
We're being invaded.
Our minds are being invaded and our society is being invaded...
REGINA: And you're saying it's a technological assimilation
of the human collective consciousness.
ICKE: Yeah, and I'm asking this.
What is Al?
And I feel this strongly after all these years of research
that AI is this Archontic force.
See, there's two types of Al.
There's algorithmic Al, codes.
And then there's what they're calling
strong Al, which is an AI that's basically
a form of consciousness.
And this is what I say is going to lead to the infusion
into this technological control system
of this Archontic distortion, which will then be controlling
human perceptions like humans were just
computer terminals on someone else's internet.
REGINA: The way we're plugged into our technology, that's
a very likely outcome, because we've given over
our own consciousness to the information that's constantly
streaming in everybody's hands.
Here on the Tube, everybody's on their own little devices,
Being programmed minute by minute.
ICKE: Yeah, well, you know, something else
I point out in the book is this very easy-to-follow process
of how this has been brought about.
Number one, you get people addicted
to technology they hold.
Then you move on to...
because you want to get inside the body.
REGINA: Because you had to put a little entertainment in there
to keep people...
keep the juice going, to keep people hooked into it.
ICKE: Then you go to technology on the body.
This is your Bluetooth, your Google Glass, your Apple Watch.
And now we're already seeing it.
You go inside the body, and many levels to that as well.
But I'm saying that this extraordinary level
of addiction to technology now, especially among the young,
is not just...
well, on one level it's the brain
becoming addicted to the electronic digital stimulation.
The speed at which the experience is happening too.
ICKE: It goes into cold turkey when
people put their phone down.
But I think there's more to it than that.
I think there's something coming off
these phones, actually, that are having an addictive impact.
And so you get people addicted to technology.
You get people-- especially when people are born into this word
now, it's all they know.
You get them to make a psychological connection
Because before you can make a physical connection,
you've got to make a psychological connection.
And once that psychological connection's made...
and this, by the way, is what these digital assistants are
all about like Echo and Alexa.
What is that doing?
That's getting people in their own homes
all the time to make a psychological connection,
an interaction to AI.
And you are seeing this psychological connection.
This is why they're having Barbie dolls
connected to the internet so young, young kids
from the earliest ages having conversation interactions
with artificial intelligence...
REGINA: Don't get me going.
I agree with you.
ICKE: This is what it's all about.
So let's talk about it now.
We're going to start looking at the story
from the other side of it.
We're seeing the problem.
And you know, certainly people say, oh my god, the problem
is so scary.
It scares me.
It's so fear-based.
But the reality is, it's just information.
It doesn't have to frighten you if you understand you have
the ultimate power over this.
The individual does have the ultimate power.
It's not as though it's not a task
to try to break free of this matrix that's been created.
But we do have the power to do so,
so let's look at it from a soul level.
Souls are still continuing to incarnate on Earth.
The soul is something much finer than AI.
It's much finer than what these low-density beings can create.
What would you say is the opportunity for a soul, who
is always looking to expand and experience
and glow and refine, to incarnate into this matrix?
ICKE: Well, I mean you know, maybe it's
not a ways free will, you know?
I mean you know, bees get attracted to honey pots,
but who's waiting with the swatter next to the honey pot?
REGINA: Well, we might disagree
on that, because I do think souls have
some say in what they're going to do.
ICKE: It depends...
I think it depends on the level of consciousness.
of what you call soul, whether they are drawn in to this
or whether they make a choice.
Probably both is true.
But the point about fear...
I mean, you know, when I started this journey,
consciously started it 30 years ago,
I was seeing what we then called New Age people...
I don't hear that phrase so much these days...
who were calling about letting go of fear.
And then they were saying to people like me,
you can't say that.
You'll frighten people.
And I used to say to them, what happened to letting go of fear?
You know, there's one thing for sure
that will make certain that we will do nothing
about what's going on, and that is
ignorance of what is going on.
REGINA: That is very true.
ICKE: The bottom lines we have
to appreciate what is happening and how the scam works,
how the perceptual manipulation works.
Because without that, we've got no chanced.
There is nothing more manipulatable than genuineness
that isn't streetwise.
Easiest thing in the world.
And so it's no good people saying:
"Well, this might frighten people, because, well, they'll
have to be frightened then".
Because if they're not frightened now,
they will be a bit further down the line.
So we face it now or we face it then,
when it's much more difficult to turn around.
And so there's two levels of it.
One, we have to understand how it works,
because by understanding the problem,
then you can understand, how to remove
the cause of the problem.
The cause of the problem is how literally comparatively
a handful of people and that consciousness they represent
controls and dictates the lives of 7.5 billion.
It's because most of the 7.5 billion
are in ignorance that it's going on,
and certainly in ignorance of how the scam works
and how they're being manipulated.
REGINA: And being kept so exhausted they don't have time
to contemplate it.
I mean, you know, it's the old thing.
Keep their heads down, and they'll never
look up and see what's actually going on.
So we need to understand what's happening.
But this is why the outward expression
of the manipulation, human society and what goes on there
should be communicated.
And for me, has to be communicated
with the nature of reality and the nature of who we are.
Because then we can not only see how this plays out,
but how it can unplay out.
We have given our minds away to a perceptual program that
gives us a particular perception of reality
and a particular perception of self.
What I'm saying is that we are interacting
with this, what you might call quantum field of possibility
and probability, within a frequency band represented
by our perceptions.
Everything in our reality is frequency.
So little me, I've got no power is a frequency.
It's a very dense frequency.
It's a very narrow frequency.
I am all that is, has been, and ever can be is an expanded
frequency, because it's an expanded self-identity,
and it is a very high, comparatively, vibrational...
REGINA: And more empowering by far.
So I'm little me, I have no power,
is interacting symbolically with this field of possibility
and probability and this narrow band.
And it creates a feedback loop in effect.
Where your perceptions become your experienced reality.
And then when you expand your awareness,
you expand your self identity, now
you're interacting with a quantum
field of possibility and probability
in a much more expanded way.
And what happens?
What happens when people so-called wake up, which means
wake up from the program or start to?
They start to notice the incredible synchronicity
in their life that suddenly starts.
These amazing coincidences, these amazing bits of luck,
Oh my goodness.
Fancy seeing you here, huh?
That's incredible to meet you here, thousands of miles
from home, and there you go.
Oh, it's amazing.
That starts to happen.
I am little me becomes I am infinite me.
And therefore, the amount of possibility and probability
that we are interacting with massively expands.
So what you man test in the feedback loop of perception
becomes experienced reality dramatically changes.
And this is-- you know, coming around
to how we started out here, if you walk through fire believing
you'll get burned, then they'll be calling an ambulance.
But if you go into other levels of awareness
that will not perceive that dynamic, that feedback loop...
I'll get burned...
then you can walk through fire and not
get burned, which of course is what people do.
REGINA: Yeah, your atomic structure literally
changes according to that thought.
And so when you are changing your perception,
you change your experienced reality.
So comming back to how we started out,
if you believe that life is random
and that you go through an aging process
because that's encoded in the body anyway,
but it can be unencoded...
and if the body's a hologram, what does
a hologram need to breathe?
Have you ever seen a hologram have to breathe?
Have you ever seen a hologram age?
But if you perceive that, then again,
the placebo symbolic effect will manifest it.
And people look around them, and what do they see?
They see people aging everywhere.
You can't do that at your age.
It's all a program.
And we have the ability to take power over that program
back any time we choose, but the program is constantly
telling us we don't have that power, because it's
self preserving itself.
REGINA: I'd like to spend some time talking about that,
because that is what people need to understand loud and clear.
They do have that power.
They need to understand how to identify
the actual I. Not the little me, but the real true self.
And so they can start aligning with that
and break free of this matrix.
ICKE: Well, if you asked almost everybody
the question who are you, they'll
give you a list of labels.
I'm a mom, I'm a TV lady, I'm a whatever.
But that's not who you are.
That's what you're experiencing.
And one of the great foundations of
this whole perceptual control of the human race
is to get people to self-identify
with their experience instead of the consciousness
that's having the experience.
You know, when people have near-death experiences
and they leave the body, and suddenly, whoa they
massively expand their awareness and can experience
multiple realities in the same moment, all that's happened
is that I has left the body, which is doing what?
It's focusing our attention in a narrow band of frequency.
So as soon as it leaves the body, that focus of attention's
gone, and suddenly you have expanded states of awareness.
That's the I.
I remember-- quick story.
When my mother died, at that point.
I'd never seen a dead body.
It just hadn't been in my experience.
But on the morning of the funeral,
I went to the funeral parlor, and there was my mother,
lying on the slab.
And I touched her hand.
Next to her was a big, blown-up picture of her,
which my brother had had done, which
was going to stand next to the coffin in the funeral service.
The body had no life.
I mean, talk about dead.
The picture was alive.
It was alive.
REGINA: It had the sparkle in her eyes, the personality
ICKE: What was in that picture but wasn't
in the body, that's who we are.
ICKE: And so when you start self-identifying
with that level of self, that I, a massive effect happens.
Because that expanded perception first of all
changes the frequency and everything
that we are operating on, and the interaction
with possibility and probability.
But it also puts what experiences
we're having into perspective.
Instead of the experiences overwhelming you
because the experiences are you, they
become something transitory that you are experiencing
And that's what this is.
And if people just realize that, I think they'd chill out more.
REGINA: I think they would.
I think the biggest issue is people say:
"but I don't know how to do that".
And so they'll go into mediation classes
and be very diligent and try to find the I in that.
And oftentimes, that doesn't work.
And you know, interestingly, in some
of the workshops I do for people,
I had this one little meditation that
is so freeing because you go back
to kindergarten, to the desires of what you
had when you were a little kid.
These unfettered desires that no one had trampled on yet.
And it is shocking how close people
start coming to what it is they are again
by going into that little experience of what they loved
when they were a child.
And I guide him through it and all.
But it seems to be so far that desire
of what one is passionate about seems
to be the closest tool to getting people up
into that field of who I am.
ICKE: And it's interesting also going on
from that to ask the question, how many people in this word
are doing what they want to do?
REGINA: Almost no one.
REGINA: Well, and that's what they all discover in this.
ICKE: They're doing what the system tells them they must do.
The whole system is set up to enforce...
mean, here's a simple thing.
What is freedom?
In this reality, what is freedom?
What is freedom anywhere?
ICKE: The more choices you have, the freer you are.
So what does the system do?
It takes choice away.
Or the perception of choice away.
And therefore, people get up in the morning
to get through to going to bed.
And so weekends become this big thing
because, oh, I've got to work, I haven't got to do this,
I haven't got to do that.
But you know, you look at it people and how many times
they're saying all the time, I've got to, got to, got to,
got to, got to.
Just take a breath.
Just, let's go through these go tos
and see what you really have to do
and which of them you perceive you have to do,
because that's the program of reality that you've taken on.
And when you realize that we are consciousness having
a transitory experience in this reality, and you know,
you haven't got to get anywhere, you
haven't got to be someone, you're already
a point of attention within all that is, has been, and ever
could be, all possibility, what do you
mean you've got to be someone?
What someone can you be that's more than
being a point of attention within all possibility?
But it's this got to, got to, got it.
And basically-- and I saw this advertisement once.
It couldn't have been a great advertisement, because I
can't remember what it was for, but it was a brilliant concept.
This child comes out of the womb at one end
and flies through the air like a missile.
And as it's flying through the air,
it's aging and aging and aging and aging.
And then it hits the cemetery at the other end.
And that's life.
It's like, got to, got to, got to.
But we haven't.
You see, someone said to me the other day,
why are you always working?
Why don't you have more in your life?
And l said: "well, because I like working".
But also because I had this perception
of what I'm doing a long time ago
that you see, people, they look at a human life
and they say it has to have this,
it has to have that, it has to have a balance.
So it has to have work, it has to have this,
it has to have that.
And so people say I go to work, and then I'll go out,
and that's my chill time, right?
Well, often it isn't these days, but that's my chill time,
I just see it over long period.
feel my perception of my life is I've come to work.
REGINA: You have come to work, and you do.
I know you well enough to know you work hard every day,
but you love what you do.
But I've come to work.
I'm at work now.
REGINA: You're here.
When you are out of your body.
ICKE: The person they call David Icke has come to work.
I didn't realize that for a long time in my life, but I do now.
I've come to work.
And when I leave this reality, I'll go and chill or something.
It's just seeing it over longer period than just
concertinaing it all into...
REGINA: Into a week, into a seven-day cycle.
ICKE: Into this transitory threescore years and 10.
REGINA: I agree.
And people want to know you, because they
want to know David.
They know this part of you.
The people that know your work know that of you.
But there are other things that you love and give you,
great joy in life besides just your work,
and I think the viewers would love
to hear a couple things that just kind of warm
your heart up.
ICKE: I love the landscape of England.
I love landscape in general.
I think they're works of art.
I love seeing people happy.
That's what makes me cry.
I don't think I've ever cried in my life
at something that was sad, because my instincts are
if can, I want to do something about it.
What makes me cry is people happy,
is people doing lovely things for people.
That's what affects me in that way.
So I get great joy from seeing the kindness of people,
because people are kind.
You know, this distortion is not all powerful,
and it's not alt controlling either.
It's just controlled the positions of power
to a very large extent, but it's not
controlled all the processes and reactions
of the human population.
And you see this kindness coming out in people often,
so I love that.
And you know, I just...
REGINA: I can think of a couple things,
just knowing you a bit.
ICKE: Oh, go on then.
You love choo choo trains.
You love steam trains and riding on trains
and looking at the country on trains.
ICKE: Yeah, I tell you what that's connected you.
I tell you what that's connected to.
It's connected to my childhood, because there is
a film crew out of California doing a film about my life
and work at the moment.
And I spoke back in Leicester, my hometown in the English
Midlands about three weeks ago and went back to all the places
that I knew as a kid, and you know,
where I used to often watch trains.
But the trains, the steam trains and all these
preserved lines in England I like to go to,
they're basically just taking you
back to what was a lovely time in my life,
a simple time in my life.
I was born in 1952, and anyone that was born more recently
would not believe how different the world is
to when I was born in 1952.
It was a simple life in the sense
that you had to make your own pleasure.
You had to be imaginative.
And what see with children today...
and this say is absolutely systematic...
is they're not just allowed to play and let
their imagination run riot and go where it wants to go.
They're focused all the time, not
least on these technological devices.
The more focused you are, the more
you're shutting out peripheral vision
and peripheral imagination.
And that, I think, is not a good thing.
I'll tell you one of the things that
hit me when I went back to the old house
where I was brought up.
My brother still lives there.
There was a green in front.
It was a big council estate.
There was a green.
But I was fortunate, given it was a council estate,
and normally it's houses as far as the eye can see.
Because there was a green just across from the house,
and there was this spinney, this wood next to it
between two roads.
And so my childhood was climbing trees and playing football
on that green.
And there were kids everywhere.
There were kids out playing football,
there were kids climbing trees, there
were kids playing hide, and seek in the forest.
And I went back, and first of all, there
was a tree that was planted at that time.
Made me think, about time.
And it was a sapling, and it was tied
to a post to hold it up till it got to some size,
could grow on its own.
That was our goal post.
That was that post.
And we put a coat down the, other side for the other post.
ICKE: I went back two weeks ago.
That tree's about this big now, this sapling I remember.
But you know what hit me when I looked?
REGINA: No kids.
ICKE: No children.
And the media has perpetuated this notion.
In the US, they call it stranger danger, stranger danger.
You walk around in the US, and these little kids
won't smile at you.
You can-- hi, you know?
Most of them will not smile back.
They'll kind of retract, like, stranger danger.
I'm not supposed to talk to you.
I don't already know you.
This to me is-- that is sad.
ICKE: Yeah, the houses where I was brought up
are family houses.
REGINA: It’s like public housing in America.
ICKE: Yeah, but they're family houses.
They're big enough for families.
And so families still live in them today.
But where are the children?
And this is changing the way that children
and young people's brains work.
ICKE: It's changing the way they perceive
the world, because you know, I've been saying
for a long time, you know, the generations that were born
before this great transformation,
this great technological transformation at least,
have a big responsibility in the sense
that we can remember what it was like against what it is now.
And therefore, we have a radar or a perceptual range
that can see the dramatic, almost indescribable changes
that have taken place in such a short time.
Whereas people born and kids born into the world
today or born in the recent past,
they're born into it as it is.
And of course, what people tend to do,
we all do is when you come into the word, you tend to think,
this is how it is.
And so they're being born into a world of to them,
this is how it is.
Whereas to someone like me born in 1952, it's like, whoa.
The transformation in such a short time is incredible.
And so it's a radar.
It's a perceptual range that when
the generations of the '50s and '60s even have gone,
that will not be there.
This is how it is.
REGINA: Well, can I just add something that kind of
gives me a little bit of hope?
You know, you look to kind of pop culture
to see where the collective mind might be headed.
And there's an interesting magazine that has just
appeared in the United States.
It's not well-known.
It's I think it's only had three editions so far.
It's called the Farmhouse Movement.
And what it's doing, it's by millennials,
and it's written for millennials.
Very short articles, lots of beautiful pictures,
but a lot of lovely how-tos and so forth
to get your fingers dirty, get your kids off
of technology, back to the land, raising little chickens
and animals, even if you just have a tiny plot of land.
all the older fellows have either died off
or sold and gone to homes.
And this land is all being bought
by young families with two and three little kids who
are all raising little animals.
And this is, in my area, ubiquitous now.
Everyone around us are these young families.
ICKE: Well, this is a point that's important to make
is that it's very clear when you observe young people today
the difference between the conscious and the unconscious.
ICKE: Because for me, the young generations today
are the most perceptually targeted
and certainly-- well, I would say in human history because
of the technological impact of that perceptual programming.
And you're seeing this creation of the snowflake mentality
where people call themselves anti-fascists
while acting like Nazis in terms of destroying freedom
of speech and everything.
And they are in so many ways the Stormtroopers
of the Orwellian world.
But at the same time, you see young people
who despite the programming, despite the perceptual
targeting from birth, basically. have seen through it
and are seeing through it.
And that's the power of consciousness over program.
And the program is the village idiot.
It's the two-stone weakling compared with consciousness
in its power.
And that's why the system has to work
so hard to keep the population in this perceptually programmed
state, because it's terrified of people waking up.
Which means what?
What does waking up mean?
If you are consciousness, but you're
operating within a bubble of that consciousness which
I would call perception, then waking up
is not finding something.
It's not even seeking something.
It's removing the perceptual onion skins of programming
to allow the true self in.
It's basically deleting the virus
so we start hearing the mouse and the keyboard again.
ICKE: This is one of the things
that won't say has irritated me over the years,
but it's made me shake my head.
You know when people want power, they
want people to think: "they have something
that others don't have, and that it's very difficult and complex
and time consuming over a period for you
that don't have it to have what I have, right?"
Now that's power, because you're telling people how difficult it
is to be like me.
It's a hoax.
It's another hoax.
I've never meditated in my life.
I've nothing against it.
I say mediate.
I don't sit there cross-legged.
I've got arthritis in my knees
I can't cross my knees anyway.
But I daydream a lot, let my mind go where it wants to go.
I do that most of the time.
It's my basically base state.
But I don't fast, you know?
I don't go out and sit in a forest for a month.
I don't do any of this stuff, I which you're supposed to do.
Or go on a quest and all this stuff.
You know, go and sit in a sweat lodge
for days on end or something.
I don't know.
And I'm not knocking any of those things.
I'm not knocking any of those things.
And I'm sure some people find them beneficial.
What I'm saying is it's not as complex as it's made out.
We are consciousness.
The scale of the consciousness we are
has been imprisoned and enslaved by myopic perception,
myopic self identity.
We change the self-identity, everything changes.
And no cross-legged on a mountain necessary.
No walking around temples in India necessary.
Just re self-identity of who we are.
And from that, everything comes.
Just for a month, just for a month try it.
Go through your life self-identifying
with being all that is, has been, and ever can be,
having an experience.
All consciousness, all possibility,
having an experience, and seeing the labels that
were your previous self identity as merely a set of experiences
And I tell you what.
If you do that and mean it, you watch the experiences change.
ICKE: You watch the experiences changed.
REGINA: No. it’s very true.
And I'm going to end on this one thing,
because I think it's so appropriate.
This was on page 666 of your book, by the way.
ICKE: Oh, symbolic.
REGINA: It's symbolic.
And it says, "No one rules if no one obeys."
It's not about protest.
It's about mass non-cooperation with the program.
ICKE: That's all it is.
And that's why we have the fault lines of divide and rule
falling into greater and greater minutiae of detail, which
is coming from the greater and greater subdivision
You know, there was a time, for instance
when you had the idea that I'm a man or I'm a woman,
These were self-identities, which
could have divide and rule fault lines put between them.
Because when there's a few and you
want to control a vast population,
you've got to get the vast population at war with itself.
Which we do politics and everything else.
If the population, you total population is united,
then you've got a big problem.
If it's in harmony, you've got a massive problem.
You need a disharmonious, chaotic state
of inter-label conflict, and then you
can pull the strings of everyone without them realizing
there are any strings at all.
And what we're seeing now with this whole transgender thing...
I could talk about that for hours
and why that's suddenly come out of nowhere...
is the minutiae of self-identity subdividing and subdividing.
We've had feminists and transgender activists
having fights in the street in Britain.
And so the more you subdivide self-identity into I am are,
and then there's a lot of letters, a lot of letters
where am I in them letters?
Oh, you're there.
You're them too.
You know, all this stuff.
I mean, hello?
Then the further you're moving away
from self identity with consciousness
to self identity with not just labels, though certainly that,
sub-labels, but with the world p of the five senses, which
self identifies with the body, not with consciousness
REGINA: Yes. indeed.
David, on that note, gosh, this has
been a wonderful conversation.
I've absolutely loved it.
I think we covered the depth of it pretty well.
Is there any final statement you'd like to make?
I mean, yes, we could talk for another 10 or 12 hours,
but considering this is roughly an hour interview.
Well, again, we come back to the self-identity.
Who is the I?
Are you little me I?
In which case, you will live a little me life.
Or are you infinite me I, in which case
your life will be dramatically different?
Because possibility is only what we believe it to be.
The more you believe in I can't, the more you won't.
The more you believe in I can do anything,
the more you will experience what you perceive.
What you believe, you perceive.
What you perceive, you experience.
And I had some posters made which
say, change your perception, change your life.
Because your life is your perception.
And these people are manipulating
human society know that.
They know that dynamic.
They know that one causes the other.
They know if they can get our perception,
they've got our experience
We take our perception back, we take our lives back.
No meditation necessary.
REGINA: Thank you so much on that note, David.
And thank you for being the warrior
you've been the last 30 years.
I know everybody thanks you for that.
But it's not been easy doing what you do.
You go through a lot to do it, but you love it.
ICKE: I do, and it gets easier.
REGINA: It does.
And you get younger as a result.
REGINA: You're hacking into the matrix yourself.
Really, you look younger than when I saw you five years ago.
Anyway, thank you, David.
Again, David's new book "Everything You Need to Know
But Have Never Been Told", which you can
find at all major booksellers.
Until next time, thank you for joining us here.
Анонс. Скоро в гостях у Меридит - известный ученый Руперт Шелдрейк
Его первое интервью с Уилкоком смотрите на русском здесь
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